Hey!
I’ve read most of the comments since there are … a lot. A lot of people talk about spiral dynamics and on another forum there are tons of example videos of what users think, who could be on what stage, a person such as comedians, spiritual people, businessman and women, personal development teachers etc. Wim Hof or politicians such as Trump, Angela Merkel, Obama, Putin etc.
I am not sure since there are a couple of people who wrote that a lot of Gen Y or Millenials and Gen Z people are not interested in the integral theory and all the concepts and theories which compartmentalize integral theory and at the same time create a holoarchy.
So, I am going to talk about what I tried to do since I liked the topic but had difficulties to get my close friends interested and the people at college, tbh. I would not necessarily define interest by a Generation per se, yet I am not totally aware of how raising a child through the context of history and time of one’s own conditioning and literally history. Vietnam war, even second world war, the fall of the Berlin wall etc. Impacts the whole generation of children raised in one “cohort”, generation. Or 15 year period etc.
Most people that I tried to introduce the integral theory and spiral dynamics which are not a lot. Did not pursue it with further interest. The two who seemed the most interested and are still open to the perspective are two people which are first of all more smarter than me and have higher compassion and openness “traits”. Also, they both were scientifically minded and aim to become scientists/professors or work in politics / a.i field.
My close friends completely dismissed it besides one, but they can’t embrace integral thinking since they are not studying and the one who is interested is highly open and enthusiastic. Yet, loses interest faster than I do which is for me nuts. They enjoy listening to the historical context, but one person can only add as much, I can’t tell how important it would be that people are and think integral, embracing holoarchies/hierarchies and big-picture thinking, accepting and including differences and similarities and embracing them, cross-paradigmatic thinking, recontextualization as far as I understand it taking in the subjective experience of a person and add it to one’s own context or perspective, similar to a pluralism or egalitarian thinking, where no one can not argue with one’s own subjective truth since it is embraced that everyone can have their own set of truths and values etc, as long as there is a distribution of power in a more decentralized manner. (Akephalie or smth similar where there is not one state/head of a tribe as a sovereign but everyone is treated equal, and in a pluralistic society that power is dispersed among different groups and for instance political parties which are independent or do not depend on each other, which is the most important part!). So,… some form of relativism and a lot more.
Most likely it was the way that I explained the topic or people and that is quite annoying sometimes become very jealous when I built a wealth of knowledge and try to explain it in a systemic way ( which I do not prepare!) and it takes some time to explain it, since my “personality type” is INFJ I loop and branch into different areas and come back to the big picture including everything that I have gathered and then I/we can loop and branch further. A lot of people even other INFJ’s become quite dismissive and don’t listen or tell me it’s to complex. Or simply don’t listen, but when I say a scientist has found out that cake is the ultimate reality, they become interested or skeptical because I need to laugh or I actually read something and want to discuss it or are interested or dismiss it or some combination.
Yet, I do feel that especially since I came back from London and I was able to have a better contrast to my primordial culture, that I felt Germany overall moves into an integral or systemic way, yet with an emotional orange line. Which then reduces everything to performance? This is what I currently think. Everything felt so odd, that the majority of the people adjusted to the moral majority which could even be green/yellow here, but is mostly green. Maybe Berlin is different a commercial I saw on youtube gave me some hope, since they were using language to avoid (orange emotional line) triggering peoples identity or rather an emotional line but in a “cross-paradigmatic” way using French and other jargon from other languages in order to not first be depicted as stupid and second of all to gain some self-respect(obviously male chimpanzees). These people were sound-designers and called themselves something with a scientist at their studio door, everyone was from a different culture/background there.
Yet, back to why I thought Germany became more systemic, simply because they respected a hierarchy of competence if I knew more about a subject and can add information in a way that is not a hindrance, respecting every possibility of culture, language, cognitive capacity, situation etc. People actually became compliant, but it just showed me how much knowledge one needs to have in order to be efficient and I read that this is one of the negative aspects of stage Yellow or second-tier thinking, trying to know everything, which is not possible To a degree. But, this was not in corporate culture, I was just taking the train back to my hometown and also the bus driver did not know the number to the ticket for the bus and train ticket, so I save money. I told him (blue/orange region) and he even gave me some additional information, which was a bit rude, a green person would most likely be pissed. (Of course, I can’t recall the exact interaction) but, I thought well I can integrate it into my network of knowledge in case I forget one alternative. Next thing that happened was the train ticket controller (excuse my Germanic roots) complained that I can’t use this train because I changed the region (state) and the provider of the tickets does not cover that, I explained to him that I bought the ticket etc. and he just explained the situation to me and was hoping for further input. It would be very nice if people would not only be at an early vision logic level of cognitive development, or morally at green, but instead also emotionally what I struggle with. I just finished watching the documentary of Osho, so I thought a state with a decentralized market, some sort of controlling entity with legislation and jurisdiction taking care of controlling a “decentralized market” so monopolies, for instance, is justified since there is a lack of competition or w/e and cartels are not being formed, while there could be a direct democracy including a normal voting system. So, the majority of the opinions of folk are represented as well as and in contrast to the expert opinion of various interest groups / political parties. While maintaining a state with a chancellor for instance. That’s just what I thought, dismissing religions here.
I went of stray to the original topic, yet with all of this theorizing I most likely think it can happen throughout the music culture, some crazy artist embracing an integral mindset because he or she is tired of the way society works and markets it in an orange/green fashion. I can’t come up with examples as perfect as “Already whole always a part” for identity politics :D. Yet, potentially already relative forever subjective. Would also be a cool slogan to infer that everyone has some relativity and subjectivity will remain, regardless of identity. That is why I liked to idea of this artist so much, they confused language so much, that at one point you have to consider their identity, which you normally would not especially as sorry and not sorry for an offending white male. Or you are mixed (color) and feel like you can be part of every minority, which is not that great for me at least, as long as you don’t speak the language.
I agree that most Gen Z and Millenial People adjust to succeed in the system, I don’t know how it has been in other generations, but there are a few outliers and many consider themselves to be outliers in order to be cooler, better or have a richer personality etc, yet hide that some old insecurity basically imo. But, there are not many in the system out of the box nuts, who dare to challenge something, mostly they find some comfort in their group and keep their interest to Netflix and chill and social gossip and monkey business and then move on to family, they lack vision and just want to be and enjoy a wonderful time which is great, there should be more integral music festivals with integral topics instead of an Osho commune .
They tried to teach us out of the box thinking and courses in creativity and all that, in college, yet at the end, people just abuse ideas and make them their own, trying to integrate everything which is good but feels very bad, people get a feeling for ideation. ( I am Gen Y / Millenial in college)
Big note family is not monkey business!
@LaWanna in case there is a website for integral humor can you send me that, that would be great and generous! I dislike most humor currently besides puns and some non-political correct humor and sarcasm sometimes.
